Trim buttons functional?

Discussion in 'ST10(+) Controller' started by Eric Jaakkola, Jul 30, 2015.

  1. Eric Jaakkola

    Eric Jaakkola Member

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    Even with gps off, the trim buttons have no effect.
     
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  2. Wieg1

    Wieg1 Member

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    They are disconnected, not needed!
     
  3. Eric Jaakkola

    Eric Jaakkola Member

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    Not needed! Are you insane? When you turn off GPS mode (which is required to go faster than 15 MPH on the Chroma) the aircraft is not even close to trimmed. I have to hold 15% forward elevator and 5% right aileron to hover.
     
  4. Wieg1

    Wieg1 Member

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    Hi Eric, on my Q500, if I turn off the GPS, I need to correct a little continuously in all directions and is more simple to work with the sticks.
    You need to pilot the copter, not to trim it !!
    If I need to hover it is a nonsense to turn off the GPS.
     
  5. Eric Jaakkola

    Eric Jaakkola Member

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    I have flown helicopters for 10 years. I'm not talking about a small random drift here. This thing is nowhere near centered, and trim is the exact solution. The radio already has the buttons.
    What nonsense is it to turn them off!
     
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  6. mrburns

    mrburns Moderator Staff Member

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    It says in the manual trim is not activated.
     
  7. Wieg1

    Wieg1 Member

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    ...dear Eric, I have flown rc aerobatic and scale aircrafts for twenty years and there, as for helicopters, trims are obviously needed, but we are talking about quadcopters for aerial videos.
    I have also a DJI Phantom and there are no trims on the transmitter, do you really think that DJI and Yuneec engineers are insane?
     
  8. Eric Jaakkola

    Eric Jaakkola Member

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    To disable a feature that is obviously still needed? Yes.
    I understand why they would not want you touching them in gps mode (though I could argue even then they could be useful for time-lapse panning) but if non-gps mode is so far off they made a poor choice.

    If their gyro calibrated accurately from the beginning, and was approximately trimmed then fine. But to do nothing to self trim AND to turn off trim when the buttons are already there is lazy and stupid.

    Just because I can fly a horribly trimmed aircraft does not mean I should be required to.

    It's also unsafe. If I fly under something that blocks gps and the craft enters failsafe suddenly it's course changes drastically.

    For indoor flying and video it's also poor design. Trying to get a smooth action when center stick has it zooming backwards and laterally at about 10mph is not helpful.

    My blade 200qx requires almost no trim and it does not have gps. So what's the deal here? A $200 quad flies better indoors than this $600 one and the only work around has been taken away for no good reason.
     
  9. Slugsie

    Slugsie Member

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    Have you tried calibrating the accelerometers? A quad does not need the trims if the accelerometers are properly calibrated. The only way it should drift is if the FC thinks it's not level when it is, thus it will attempt to correct when it shouldn't. The way to fix that is to calibrate the accelerometers.

    That being said, I've used yaw trim on my Blade 350QX as a way of initiating a nice steady controlled pan for video recording. But that's about the only use for trims.
     
  10. hol

    holmes6 New Member

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    Was looking for this for yaw panning. Even at the lowest rate the yaw is too fast for video at the limit of the stick and it's hard to keep it perfectly smooth at a partial deflection. Guess I need to learn how to do that better.
     
  11. SparkoRC

    SparkoRC Active Member

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    Just be very gentle in controlling the yaw stick movement it just takes a bit of practice, I found as I had been originally flying my phantom using fat shark dominator fpv goggles any slow yaw movement was easier to master, the transition to flying my Q500 4 k was initially harder to master very slow yaw movements consistently, but in the end it just takes practice and more practice to get the desired results.

    However I did come across this yaw resistance control item I have know idea if it works or not, looking a the picture it appears to have some sort rubber bands to restrict movement ! its obviously not same as using a spare switch to control the rates on the yaw movement

    http://www.aliexpress.com/item/YUNE...5.html?spm=2114.40010708.4.63.53F3lE#feedback
     
  12. janjaap

    janjaap Active Member

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    Aply for a job as an engineer at Yuneec....... :p;)
     
  13. Sticks

    Sticks Active Member

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    I have to agree with the OP here. In a zero wind environment, with the equipment the Q500 has on board, if you do have drifting, you should be able to adjust the trim to keep it steady with GPS off. Mine has a distinct right yaw and reverse direction with the GPS off.

    Another simple matter of programming the system if the ST10 has those wires from the switches hooked up, and it's only active in GPS off mode.

    ETA - On a hunch/whim, I went into the ST10 calibration mode and tried to see if I could get the trim to work there, still no love. There might be a secret handshake that you have to do, or make adjustments prior to getting them to the "Pass" phase.

    I have visions of the programmer is from the PS1 video game era where you had to do a sequence of controller moves for "Special" actions in the game or cheat codes. (Left, Right, Right, A, B, D, D, Fwd, Bk, Bk) to enter "GOD" mode and make those changes. It might explain why there are "beeps" when you move the left stick....Like I said, visions. Only the designers and programmers know.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2016
  14. unf

    unfaix Member

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    Oh My Gosh, i've been telling poeple all these time, and everyone kept telling me that without gps, the damn should drif and fly off with out any input, yes small input is needed to keep it still , but this damn thing flies and needs a lot of trim not just one or two steps.

    I posted these and their response is as expected like everyone elses.

    I stop trying, got a 4k for sale, comes with all the goodies.
     

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  15. Sticks

    Sticks Active Member

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    Unfaix - You gotta remember, these things were designed first and foremost as a camera platform, mild speed, good stability (GPS) with some features. Second - RTF out of the box for any jackslap that can read the quick start guide.

    These are awesome little machines despite the drifting issues with GPS off.

    I'd keep the 4k, and pick up a 250mm race quad to get your speed and GPS free flying kicks.
     
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  16. Decal Dennis

    Decal Dennis New Member

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    With any aircraft, you have to give it input to make it do what you want.
     
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  17. Sticks

    Sticks Active Member

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    Our point is that with this particular UAV, with the GPS turned off, in a dead calm air, it will drift really bad. Not just a little.

    One should not have to hold the sticks at 15% left yaw, 10% right rudder, and 10% reverse to hold position in calm conditions (as an example).

    But as I stated, the Q was not designed to be flown with GPS off, just an unlikely option.
     
  18. Stinger

    Stinger Member

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    @Eric Jaakkola
    Have you tried to calibrate the Sticks of your ST-10+?
    Go to "System Settings" - "About Flight Mode Control" and tap on "Android Version" quickly 4 times.
    Now select "Controller Test", " Enter" (Controller Test), "Next", "Start" and move every Controller to it's limit. Tap "Next" and move all Controllers to their limits again, press every Button and move the Switch. Tap "Finish" and leave the MenĂ¼ with "Back" or "Home".
    Your drone should now hover stable.
    You can check, whether the controls are off center any time in " Flight Settings" - "Hardware Monitor".
     
  19. Sticks

    Sticks Active Member

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    Stinger - I've checked mine prior to calibration, and it showed that all sticks were zero, GPS off, still had drift.

    This is more than likely a motor speed issue - they are not 100% identical, plus dozens of other factors that come into play (resistance in the connections, minor differences in wire length, ESC's...) between the control board and the props.

    Like simple flashers on cars. You can line up 10 of the exact same make, model and year of car, turn on the left turn signal all at the same time, and none of them will flash at the same rate/stay synchronized.
     
  20. Stinger

    Stinger Member

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    Well, either calibrating the Drone or the Transmitter should do it. -Always did it for me at least...
    Can't imagine that minor differences in the motors could cause that. -A seriously damaged bearing maybe. But you would hear that.
    The Hardware (Mainboard, IMU, ESC) and Software check all the values a 1000 times per second and adapt the RPM of each motor at the same rate. If minor differences in cable length would have such an impact, no drone would ever fly.

    Did you connect your your Drone to the Computer an check it with the GUI-Software? Maybe the IMU has a glitch. (Can be swapped easily. ~40$, 4 screws (once the Mainboard is out ;-) ) maybe that's worth a try...)

    With GPS off a slight drift will always occur through wind or groundeffect when hovering at low altitude. Thats quite normal. Flying my helis (no GPS) I have to permanently give tiny input to keep them in one place (and piece *lol*) even though they are set up fine.
     
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